Discussions By Condition: I cannot get a diagnosis.

Everyone is having the same symptoms In the house we just moved into

Posted In: I cannot get a diagnosis. 27 Replies
  • Posted By: Anonymous
  • December 22, 2008
  • 05:51 PM

Hi, We Just moved Into a new house that was build in 2006 and so far most everyone who lives there has developed the same Symptoms. (Numbness-tingling-stiffness in there hands a fingers and one person has it in his leg.

In my case The symptoms awake me At night and I notice My hand feel like there are a sleep and there is a hot to wamer feeling on the top of my hand/s. All these symptoms started within the 1st week or two of moving in. I had a uncle stay 2 to 3 nights a few times in the last few weeks and he has started to have the same symptoms too.

One Doctor said it was carpel tunnel But that can't be the case.(too many family members getting it at the same time. The house is about 2800 sqft and was a bank owed home so I'm thinking there might be a mold or radon in the home.

The house looks new but I did notice some mildew stains in the entry way. I also noticed that there is a about 4 or 5 white spots on the black title room. We also had a big ant problem that is being handled by the -xtreminator company.


I'm at a loss at what it could be.... Any help would be Great.

Thanks
Chris

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27 Replies:

  • I am assuming you moved into the house after the ant extermination? If so, what chemical did they use and where was it used in the house? Look into that as it may be affecting all of you. And if you gave the symptoms of all your family members to your doctor and he said carpel tunnel, I would find another doctor. Did you look closely at the disclosures for the house in the closing documents? Any mention of mold or anything else?Have to spoken to your neighbors to see if they have experienced any of the same symptoms? If it is radon, you might not be the only one with the problems. And they may know other things about your home you are not aware of.Since all of you are experiencing symptoms including a guest, I think something toxic is in your home which is making you sick. Perhaps there is a company who can test for toxins in your home. Might be expensive, but so are health problems. If specific poisons were used for the ant problem without your knowledge, this may be something you want to know. Especially if you have young children. Don't wait on this.
    Beth56 272 Replies
    • December 23, 2008
    • 01:07 AM
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  • Where do you live? DOM
    acuann 3,080 Replies
    • December 23, 2008
    • 03:41 AM
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  • I am assuming you moved into the house after the ant extermination? If so, what chemical did they use and where was it used in the house? Look into that as it may be affecting all of you. And if you gave the symptoms of all your family members to your doctor and he said carpel tunnel, I would find another doctor. Did you look closely at the disclosures for the house in the closing documents? Any mention of mold or anything else?Have to spoken to your neighbors to see if they have experienced any of the same symptoms? If it is radon, you might not be the only one with the problems. And they may know other things about your home you are not aware of.Since all of you are experiencing symptoms including a guest, I think something toxic is in your home which is making you sick. Perhaps there is a company who can test for toxins in your home. Might be expensive, but so are health problems. If specific poisons were used for the ant problem without your knowledge, this may be something you want to know. Especially if you have young children. Don't wait on this.We moved in before...We had the Symptoms about two weeks before we had the Ant extermination.This was a foreclosure bought home So nothing is listed in the disclosures about mold. The former owners where upside down on the mortgage and tryed to sell it for over a year before they lost it to the bank. The house was sold at a auction and bought by some investors and then listed for sale. The house is in a gated subdivison and was in like new condition.Anything is possible even with a newer home. There could have been water damage that we can't see or as you mentioned poisons that another Ant extermination company used before we moved in that we don't know about.Does anyone think That there Could be something in the air ducts in the home that would make us sick? How about in the carpets? I'm going to see a new doc and get some blood work done and go from there. I will look into companys that test for toxins and get some tests done.Thanks for the help Beth56 and if anyone else has any thoughts please help.Chris.
    Anonymous 42,789 Replies
    • December 23, 2008
    • 06:42 AM
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  • Where do you live? DOMNorthern California
    Anonymous 42,789 Replies
    • December 23, 2008
    • 06:45 AM
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  • Yes,it's obviously exposure to the same thing,but what is it?You could call your local Poison Control Center for help,as well as doing the other things that have been recommended.:)
    richard wayne2b 1,232 Replies
    • December 23, 2008
    • 01:17 PM
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  • It does sound like a problem with mold. You can buy home mold kits. Sounds like you'll need a few to test out the house. After you obtain the air sample, you need to send it to the lab and I think that is another $40. Be sure and follow the directions. There is a big trick to it. You use the taller and smaller diameter as the bottom. Pour the solution into the bottom and cover it with the top for an hour. Then you take it to the area where you suspect mold and take the top off. You can put it inside ducts, too. I acutally last used the same one in several different areas and now have three different types of fuzzy mold growning on my sample (from work, yikes). If you see mold growing, you can scrape the wall spot with the q-tip and put that on the bottom mold tray. But if you see it, there is a problem and you can begin to attack it. there could also be carbon monoxide. You need a carbon monoxide detector and move it around room to room check for levels. The poison from the ant kill is exacerbating the entire situation. Try "cedarcide" solutions next time. You could have other things, but these seem to jump up at me.
    Monsterlove 2,921 Replies
    • December 26, 2008
    • 07:21 AM
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  • Please ignore poor ''Blaze'';she's ablaze with a witchhunt upon electromagnetic sensitization,something most rational people don't think exists or at least,not to the degree that zealots like her propose.If you read any of the ''junk'' science she points at you,please read the opposing views,which are easy to find on the ''net.''
    richard wayne2b 1,232 Replies
    • December 26, 2008
    • 00:13 PM
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  • Please ignore poor ''Blaze'';she's ablaze with a witchhunt upon electromagnetic sensitization,something most rational people don't think exists or at least,not to the degree that zealots like her propose.If you read any of the ''junk'' science she points at you,please read the opposing views,which are easy to find on the ''net.''In fact, I'm going to start calling her the''McCarthy of electromagnetism!'':)
    richard wayne2b 1,232 Replies
    • December 26, 2008
    • 00:16 PM
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  • Okay, this is likely due to multiple chemical exposure and is somewhat more common than you might think. Particularly in recently acquired homes, the heavy use of cleaning and pesticide products will produce an environment capable of inducing exposure symptoms. Respiratory complaints continue to be the most common, followed closely by dermatitis and finally systemic complaints related to sensory neuropathy, etc. Pyrethroid exposure is quite common for persons who react strongly to insecticide agents. If the ant problem was significant enough, it's likely that an insecticide agent in this class was used to curb the problem and I would ask whether you had taken steps to try and exterminate the ants with any type of pesticides yourself prior to contacting the exterminator. While I don't suggest it's the case here, a common error in tackling a significant insect problem is to inadvertently use outdoor only products in strong quantities to swiftly take care of the problem. Some classes of pyrethrins and particularly pyrethroids in more industrial concentrations may be used safely outdoors but can cause exposure symptoms if used within enclosed areas of the home. The pesticide can remain highly active for many weeks on floor and wall surfaces. Sensory neuropathies can occur with mild exposure to this insecticide agent but realize that sufficient contact is necessary, ie walking around barefoot. The offgassing of new carpet, if installed, is yet another source to add to the mixture that can be responsible for exposure symptoms. Also within the category of vapors that can induce exposure symptoms is the unwitting mixture of certain cleaning agents that when combined, can produce gases that are toxic in nature. The most common mistake is mixing bleach with other cleaning agents that can produce a type of chlorine gas. While the effects are mostly immediate in nature, realize that in a home with recirculating air and no fresh outlets, the circumstances can cause the offending agents to remain for many weeks. Incidentally, mold exposure is exclusively respiratory in nature and the development of sensory neuropathy would not be among the symptoms. The same holds true for radon exposure. As radon decays, it produces particate matter than can be inhaled. There are no immediate symptoms to radon exposure, but rather over time causes changes to cells and is considered carcinogenic in nature. Steps should be taken to thoroughly ventilate the home for several days while using strictly neutral solutions to wash down surfaces in the home, change out all air filters and clean any linens that may have been permeated during the course of the few weeks you've been in the home and have the carpets cleaned if such floor coverings exist. Best regards, J Cottle, MD
    JCottleMD 580 Replies
    • December 26, 2008
    • 02:51 PM
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  • Dear Dr.Cottle:How is it that you're such an expert in so many fields?I've never seen anyone with such a breadth of knowledge.Thank you.
    richard wayne2b 1,232 Replies
    • December 26, 2008
    • 03:24 PM
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  • I agree. I think it’s due to long experience and taking the profession seriously instead of spending all your time on the golf course. I do hope that dr Cottle stays around even though he has been threatening us with leaving this forum. He has helped so many patients. I would like to say, from all of us - Thank you and Merry Christmas, dr Cottle! :)
    Felsen 510 Replies
    • December 26, 2008
    • 03:47 PM
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  • Dr. Cottle,The overhead sprinkler system went off during the night where I work. After they drained the floor, I went back to work and immediately had breathing sensitivity. The next day, the breathing became worse, eyes burned, dizziness, face was red...asthma-like conditions began to appear throughout the week and I didn't used to have asthma. Next, a rash appeared on my hands and neck/arms, all along smelling the musty moldy room. Sinus went next, whites of eyes went red one night...it would get better when I would go home but after 3 weeks, it stuck with me and went into my chest.I found the black mold under the sink and that was replace/cleaned unprofessionally and symptoms have improved a bit, however, the walls and ceilings never addressed--where the original flood happened. So, the bottom line is, it's more than respiratory. I have never had a rash before this flood, or the symptoms..but Winter break and I should be well before heading back in January...just to start it all over again... Back to the original poster..you don't know what the other people before you did for the ants, but yes, they probably did use something for it. But, new homes do have all of the chemicals used to put it all together and it can impact your well-being. I vote for the ant pesticide as the first obvious.
    Monsterlove 2,921 Replies
    • December 27, 2008
    • 04:44 AM
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  • Well, there you have it; I can't play golf so maybe my achilles heel has proven beneficial in some aspects. As for being an "expert," I'm afraid I fall very short of such a plateau and as an old and trusted colleague informed me, an expert is quickly broken down into the following representations: ex is a has-been and spert is merely a drip under pressure. As an octogenarian of 84 this past fall season, you realize that mere exposure to information through the years will force competence upon you to some extent whether willing or not. Despite this revelation, however, it very disappointingly proves to be a race with no finish line. To Monsterlove: I'm curious how you know your symptoms to be the consequence of mold exposure? The observation of mold under the sink or elsewhere does not necessarily represent the underlying pathogen. Cause and effect analysis can be quite misleading in many instances and in the absence of undergoing actual clinical evaluation for allergenic response to the mold spores wherein a similar response would be obtained, or testing other environmental conditions within your workplace for noxious elements, there's little more than anecdotal evidence to support your contention. The constellation of factors described by the person initiating the thread appear somewhat commonly within the emergency department or family practitoner's office. People rarely contemplate the synergistic nature of chemistry prior to the use of multiple cleaning products, pesticides, new carpet or paint and even air fresheners as they prepare a newly purchased home for residency. I must also point out, however, that even in this instance the cause is not certain and my comments are based on past experience and not direct analysis. Best regards, J Cottle, MD
    JCottleMD 580 Replies
    • December 27, 2008
    • 01:29 PM
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  • Dear Dr.Cottle:There's no way you're 84!Your brain works the way mine did when I was 25.Your erudition puts me to shame,And I'm an M.D.,too.Plus,I just turned 61.Were you as good a clinician as you are a medical authority?I once read 3 journals a month and was quite sharp,but I feel dimwitted compared to you!Thank you.
    richard wayne2b 1,232 Replies
    • December 27, 2008
    • 02:42 PM
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  • :):)Dear Dr.Cottle:There's no way you're 84!Your brain works the way mine did when I was 25.Your erudition puts me to shame,And I'm an M.D.,too.Plus,I just turned 61.Were you as good a clinician as you are a medical authority?I once read 3 journals a month and was quite sharp,but I feel dimwitted compared to you!Thank you.
    richard wayne2b 1,232 Replies
    • December 27, 2008
    • 02:45 PM
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  • You know Doctor, you have a fan club. You should teach a class to people interested in medicine. Yes, it was cause and effect with the mold at work. Big flood...activation of former mold from past leaks=big trouble for me with the instant reaction the same day of the flood, basically. Well, they finally brought in someone to take a mold sample, but with my symptoms improving since removal of the nasty black mold, that was pretty clear that it was involved with the entire experience. Actually, the sink was a former shower stall and when I pulled the false floor out, I saw that the plumbing was not complete with a finished pipe. Every time you turned the water on, it was splashing around under the false floor, creating an on-going mess. My bosses think like you, however....:eek:
    Monsterlove 2,921 Replies
    • December 27, 2008
    • 06:00 PM
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  • I'm moved by such kind words for an old fellow but rest assured that the term authority is well over-stated. I'm indeed 84 and have a sister that will turn 90 years of age in January. She can still outrun me and likely cogitate faster as well. As for any reflection of my days as a clinician, I was definitely favored more by my patients than by my colleagues, whose constant and unanimous voice of dissatisfaction rested in my inability to keep pace with their notions of service delivery that was measured more by the constraints of time than any full measure of devotion to the science. I dare say that it was a graphic illustration of the fabled tortoise and the hare, since I'm the only living member left of the bunch. A mad dash for the finish line will often bring it forth. Best regards, J Cottle, MD
    JCottleMD 580 Replies
    • December 27, 2008
    • 07:15 PM
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  • Clear out all cockroaches and the feces they leave behind. It may mean moving all of your belongings out and inspecting them for little dots on the paper edges of your books. If you swab all books with an alcohol and linseed oil solution, you may be able to save your books. More important, you will save yourself.
    billriddle 1 Replies
    • December 27, 2008
    • 10:51 PM
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  • Dr Cottle, I must add that from your every post I am not only learning medical science, but also English language. You must be a truly extraordinary person. If you would have not become a doctor, you would have had a great career as a writer. Your English is like poetry. :) Sorry for “hi-jacking” your thread, Ineedhelpfast!
    Felsen 510 Replies
    • December 27, 2008
    • 10:58 PM
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  • Well, again I'm very appreciative of such kind words. The forum has provided me with a good outlet for my constant stirring well into the night sometimes and I've enjoyed speaking with everyone . . . well almost everyone. I must admit my frustration concerning the obvious limitations of the whole internet concept and have, at times, let my manners slip. On the whole, it's been quite pleasurable thus far and I'm glad to have participated. Old dogs can still learn new tricks. Best regards, J Cottle, MD
    JCottleMD 580 Replies
    • December 28, 2008
    • 02:20 AM
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