Discussions By Condition: I cannot get a diagnosis.

round worms?

Posted In: I cannot get a diagnosis. 7 Replies
  • Posted By: taniaaust1
  • January 19, 2009
  • 08:34 AM

Im currently housesitting another home for the past couple of weeks and last week found worms in the bedroom toilet. I think i used that loo so i dont know if they are mine or another.

The black worms were a type i didnt know (not threadworms) and there were HEAPS :( .. about a handful, so i figure this person probably has a major infestation. They swim and also are able to pull themselves along the bottom of a jar with their heads. (i dont know if they are able to live outside water, i didnt test one out). They were up to about 13 millimetres in size but all sizes.. (13mm is about the thickness of a female thumb.. that's their length and they are about half a width of a maggot).

i took some down to the chemist/pharmacy to ask them there would they were but the stupid guy there tried to tell me they were just mosquito lavea. I then got a couple of friends to look at them and we all agreed, they certainly were not mosquito lavae but were some kind of worms.

So i then took some down to the states pathology lab to ask them if they knew what they were. The nurse there told me to take them and go straight to our main states hospital with them throu the er (casuality dept) as their wouldnt be a cost involved. (or they would of tested them if i was willing and able to pay). (it kind of sounded weird to me that the worms were considered important enough to go throu the ER of the main hospital).

After a 7hr wait there (they had to provide me a bed as I cant be upright that long) the doctor finally got to me and took a look at the container of worms and told me he thought they may be roundworms thou he was no worm expert so he was going to take them to the path lab there.

He came back still discussing them with another doctor and i then got told that they arent even from Australia (I live in Australia) so i then was getting questioned about my overseas travel. (ive only travelled to NZ a year ago and those worms are rare there too).

(the lab is going to analyse them to confirm what they were all thinking about them but wont have the results for 2 weeks).

Any other thoughts here about what those black worms could be.. the doctors didnt think they are hook worms.
.........

oh and if these did come from me.. could the worms cause vaginal bleeding??

i have been spotting on and off for the past few weeks and put it down to not eatting well thou it's never happened to me before when i wasnt eatting well.
I started eatting again and stopped spotting.. but then it has since started up again. (the spotting is a new symptom up on top of all the other ones I have with the CFIDS)

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7 Replies:

  • Here's a very strange question for you, Tania. Have your CFS symptoms imrpoved at all over the last several weeks? "Worms" can cause problems, but some may actually promote healing: http://www.news-medical.net/?id=1778 I was going to show you this anyway as I happened across it recently & thought of your struggle, but there is a lot of support in the medical literature that certain pathogens, some worms included, may shift the cytokine pattern from Th1 to Th2, or simply put, away from allergy/autoimmune response. Not to give you a whole science lesson, but Th2 cells fight parasites and other pathogens, and when there are none to fight,the body becomes confused & essentially attacks itself. A *vast* oversimplification, but that's the general gist. I thought of you specifically because this abstract mentions CFS directly. I can't speak to the science or any potential author conflicts-of-interest as I haven't read the whole article, but the product is still available under a different name. With your doctor's help, this may be something simple and affordable to try. Cheers-- 1: Posit Health News. 1998 Spring;(No 16):16-8. Soil-based organisms improve immune function: shift cytokine profile from TH2 to TH1. AIDS: SRL 172, a protein derived from a soil-based organism, is advertised forbeing able to restart the immune systems of persons with allergies, lung cancer, and tuberculosis. SRL 172 also appears to shift the cytokine profile in personswith Gulf War Syndrome and Chronic Fatigue Syndrome from TH2 back to the moreeffective TH1 profile. One patient reports improved DTH skin responses to topicalDNCB after using Nature's Biotics Soil-based Organisms (SBOs). There alsoappeared to be improved immunity response indicating a shift from a weaker TH2 toa TH1 cytokine profile. The patient explains his successful use of SBOs andreveals that all but 1 out of 100 other patients who have used the product for a variety of ailments cite successful outcomes. Among the ailments whose symptomsthe SBOs have helped relieve are foot sores from diabetes, Chronic FatigueSyndrome, insomnia, and genital herpes. Recent use of SBOs by HIV-infectedpatients has had positive results in energy and weight gain and improvements insome types of chronic conditions indicating an improvement of cell mediatedimmunity and antibody production. PMID: 11365013
    aquila 1263 Replies
    • January 19, 2009
    • 01:12 PM
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  • Aquila:would you explain what a cytokine actually is,in simple terms,please.
    richard wayne2b 1232 Replies
    • January 19, 2009
    • 02:05 PM
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  • I'll try: they're proteins secreted during an immune or inflammatory response. They "control" (mediate) what happens inside the body when it is injured im some way. For the medically minded, there's a nice brief synopsis here: http://www.ccmtutorials.com/infection/sepsis/page4.htm Don't ask me for much more. My area of expertise is the coagulation cascade. :-)
    aquila 1263 Replies
    • January 19, 2009
    • 05:37 PM
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  • thanks aquila :) Here's a very strange question for you, Tania. Have your CFS symptoms imrpoved at all over the last several weeks? "Worms" can cause problems, but some may actually promote healing: nope they havent improved at all... im still up and down and all over the place as per normal (right now i have a headache). thanks for that info.. i did find it extremely interesting. I should pose the question in the CFS forums to ask if any of them have had improvement while having a case of worms. lol Ive finally come to the conclusion after taking wormer for all different kinds of worms and seeing no evidence there and the fact these worms can still be alive in the toilet after 10 days :eek:, and the fact ive never been overseas where these usually are. Im now doubting very much that they did come from myself. (it's still a mystery thou as there is only several of us who ever use that bedroom toilet and they dont have any evidence they came from them either).
    taniaaust1 2267 Replies
    • January 22, 2009
    • 06:07 AM
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  • If you want to read more about this theory, go to Medline at www.pubmed.gov and search for "hygiene hypothesis." I'm most familiar with the work of Dr. Joel Weinstock and Dr. David Pritchard. There was also a great layperson article about this in either Newsweek or Time back in Nov. of 2007.
    aquila 1263 Replies
    • January 22, 2009
    • 08:38 PM
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  • Here's a pretty good article to start off with: http://healthlink.mcw.edu/article/1031002421.html My interest is as a researcher. I presented a paper on this at an international scientific conference last year. So far, using this theory they've looked at Crohn's & colitis, and currently under study are MS, asthma & allergy, and soon celiac disease. I wasn't really surprised to see CFS associated with this theory It seems to fit the profile of autoimmune states. Not sure about the efficacy of the treatment mentioned in the abstract, but since this kind of therapy while available is extremely expensive & not covered by insurance, the pills may be worth a try. But please involve your doctor in the process. No one knows what the risks are related to these therapies. They're too new. Keep me up on your progress, ok? Take care.
    aquila 1263 Replies
    • January 22, 2009
    • 08:59 PM
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  • nods.. i can too see how this info may fit with CFS too. but there is a lot of support in the medical literature that certain pathogens, some worms included, may shift the cytokine pattern from Th1 to Th2, or simply put, away from allergy/autoimmune response The Th1/Th2 shift in CFS as far as i know isnt a proven theory yet thou thou it's looking like that does happen in this illness (with our bodies locked in to fight "stealth viruses" or whatever). Thou some, eg via The Marshall Protocol, are having success with shifting their body away from that dominance state. Most thou, their bodies tend to revert back to the CFS state after that treatment, (that is if they managed to actually stay with it and didnt end up with MAJOR side effects from that Marshall treatment eg Addison's disease). Due to this (the usual lack of success wih cure on the TH1/TH2 theory.. thou i know about a third maybe a little more, do say they do come out cured but then i myself wonder for how long, as i know this illness does tend to relapse), Im currently of the thought that changing this dominance would in fact not cure this illness. (umm but maybe one could keep worms permanently there to keep body in more of a right balance). I dont like to disappoint you but at this point arent willing to attempt such a treatment (im wary of medical experiments). (i find the whole thought of that kind of worm experiementation on my already very sick body.. kind of scary). but thanks for the info.. it IS very interesting and an interesting idea. Thanks for sharing it
    taniaaust1 2267 Replies
    • January 23, 2009
    • 11:28 AM
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