Discussions By Condition: I cannot get a diagnosis.

my daughter has frequent spasms ? i need help

Posted In: I cannot get a diagnosis. 13 Replies
  • Posted By: enriqueveogente
  • March 30, 2009
  • 11:04 PM

hello
my baby (4 and a half years ) has had what seems to be muscular spasms ever since she was born at first she used to just outstretch her arms and curl her fingers around but with an expression of anxiousness, it seemed as if she had some sort of chemical trigger but we were told by the doctor and health visitor that these were common in children (so common i cant find anything relating to them yet), and she would grow out of it ......How-ever as time goes by i have been more and more distressed by what has now developed into a frequently recurring spasmodic reaction ...to what or why i dont know but i do know it is triggered .. it happens when we go into the car i watch her in the mirror and shes twitching now she grips her hands together in what seems to be an effort to combat or at least suppress the occurrence, it also happens when she anticipates something usually the vistit to the park or meeting people or at times when she has to wait and is conscious of her surroundings they seem to occur on an almost daily basis in little bout of three or four times of perhaps three or four seconds each ..sometimes i count around twenty times a day when im off work (9-5) i spend all my time with her and although i can sometimes calm her down with a mental diversion it is getting to be very distressing for me knowing she is conscious of it
i know it not something she will grow out of within the foreseeable and i am constantly worrying about her at school i have asked the teachers to watch and record the frequency so i might convince the nurse to inquire some more and i have decided i am now going to pursue as many avenues as possible until i know what it is and what is causing it ....i have no medical knowledge or training but i do know this is not something that will just "go away" if you have information or can help explain please respond .
thank you

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  • hello my baby (4 and a half years ) has had what seems to be muscular spasms ever since she was born at first she used to just outstretch her arms and curl her fingers around but with an expression of anxiousness, it seemed as if she had some sort of chemical trigger but we were told by the doctor and health visitor that these were common in children (so common i cant find anything relating to them yet), and she would grow out of it ......How-ever as time goes by i have been more and more distressed by what has now developed into a frequently recurring spasmodic reaction ...to what or why i dont know but i do know it is triggered .. it happens when we go into the car i watch her in the mirror and shes twitching now she grips her hands together in what seems to be an effort to combat or at least suppress the occurrence, it also happens when she anticipates something usually the vistit to the park or meeting people or at times when she has to wait and is conscious of her surroundings they seem to occur on an almost daily basis in little bout of three or four times of perhaps three or four seconds each ..sometimes i count around twenty times a day when im off work (9-5) i spend all my time with her and although i can sometimes calm her down with a mental diversion it is getting to be very distressing for me knowing she is conscious of it i know it not something she will grow out of within the foreseeable and i am constantly worrying about her at school i have asked the teachers to watch and record the frequency so i might convince the nurse to inquire some more and i have decided i am now going to pursue as many avenues as possible until i know what it is and what is causing it ....i have no medical knowledge or training but i do know this is not something that will just "go away" if you have information or can help explain please respond .thank youHi enriqueveogente,My sympathies. This must be quite distressing to you.Has she exhibited an spasms in any other part of her body? When she has the hand spasms, does she appear to be distressed by them? Have you ever seen the spasms you describe when she is asleep?Also, do you have any other children who have (or any family history of) any type of neurological/neuromuscular conditions?Regards,John
    JonMac 165 Replies Flag this Response
  • hello and thanks for the reply'si had no idea that antenna or transmitters could cause stressful disorders i had heard a while ago about concerns of living under masts but have not taken any notice since, i am not going to dismiss the idea and will look carefully at all the links and possible causes one by one but at the moment i really dont attribute it to phone emissions it is far to complex and idiosyncratic to be an external trigger at least that is my opinion at the moment ..i am more of the opinion that it may be related to the jabs for mmr and other inoculations but still as yet am keeping an open mind ..Thanks Blaze i will pursue it as a possibility,JonMac you have raised a few good points too my friend as far as i know there is no history of mental conditions in the family and the only other child her sister is not mine but displays all normality (as far as i can tell) there are no signs of it when she's asleep i have her in my bed a few nights of the week as mum works nights and there have never been any movements or erratic behavior (apart from her nicking the quilt :) so im sure it only affects her consciously ,there are no other parts of her body involved apart from her gripping her hands together in an effort to suppress it. its seems to be a mental seizure that occupies her subconsciously as if her nervous system is getting a crossed wire if that makes sense, as she seems to be fully aware of it and is even showing signs of disguising it as much as she can ,i think she is embarrassed as she always exclaims " i'm alright daddy" as if she is determined not to let it bother her ..but its worrying me more as time goes by i don't want to find out i could have prevented something worse occurring i have asked her teacher to record the frequency and im amazed that they have never seen her do it as i am certain it happens in thier presence (i am not going to let them ignore it ) and i am now keeping a diary of her spasmswhile she's in my care Thanks again for helping me please relate any ideas as i am searching for an answer and it doesn't help being alone on the net. sometimes scaring myself to death with all the possibilities i went on you tube and typed in spasms there are a few similarities but nothing matching so im going to video her and stick it on the tube for a response .. Thanks again for my benefit it is relieving to know i have a sounding board and i really do appreciate it ,,thank you
    enriqueveogente 6 Replies Flag this Response
  • hello and thanks for the reply'si had no idea that antenna or transmitters could cause stressful disorders i had heard a while ago about concerns of living under masts but have not taken any notice since, i am not going to dismiss the idea and will look carefully at all the links and possible causes one by one but at the moment i really dont attribute it to phone emissions it is far to complex and idiosyncratic to be an external trigger at least that is my opinion at the moment ..i am more of the opinion that it may be related to the jabs for mmr and other inoculations but still as yet am keeping an open mind ..Thanks Blaze i will pursue it as a possibility,JonMac you have raised a few good points too my friend as far as i know there is no history of mental conditions in the family and the only other child her sister is not mine but displays all normality (as far as i can tell) there are no signs of it when she's asleep i have her in my bed a few nights of the week as mum works nights and there have never been any movements or erratic behavior (apart from her nicking the quilt :) so im sure it only affects her consciously ,there are no other parts of her body involved apart from her gripping her hands together in an effort to suppress it. its seems to be a mental seizure that occupies her subconsciously as if her nervous system is getting a crossed wire if that makes sense, as she seems to be fully aware of it and is even showing signs of disguising it as much as she can ,i think she is embarrassed as she always exclaims " i'm alright daddy" as if she is determined not to let it bother her ..but its worrying me more as time goes by i don't want to find out i could have prevented something worse occurring i have asked her teacher to record the frequency and im amazed that they have never seen her do it as i am certain it happens in thier presence (i am not going to let them ignore it ) and i am now keeping a diary of her spasmswhile she's in my care Thanks again for helping me please relate any ideas as i am searching for an answer and it doesn't help being alone on the net. sometimes scaring myself to death with all the possibilities i went on you tube and typed in spasms there are a few similarities but nothing matching so im going to video her and stick it on the tube for a response .. Thanks again for my benefit it is relieving to know i have a sounding board and i really do appreciate it ,,thank youHi again enriqueveogente,Happy to help you, if at all possible. First, if her symptoms are limited to hand spasms that are not appearing while she is sleeping, it honestly doesn't appear that your daughter has any dreaded affliction. To be sure I understand your situation fully...you are "Dad" but from your statement "i am now keeping a diary of her spasms while she's in my care", it sounds as though you are not her custodial parent?If not, are these spasms occurring when she is with her custodial parent (? Mom)? Also, do you think it possible that her teachers haven't observed the occurrences because they may not be happening at school? Have her teachers voiced ANY observations regarding her demeanor, behavior, appearance, activity level in class that could be considered "out of the ordinary"?Do you think there could be a possibility that this could be an attention-seeking behavior happening primarily while she is with you?The more detailed the information regarding your situation, the greater the understanding.Regards,John
    JonMac 165 Replies Flag this Response
  • JonMacthanks again for replying it really helps to talk..and after i posted i spoke to my boss whom has a five year old to that he says show signs of excitement by rubbing his face and showing a "mad expression" his words..and while i find it reassuring that people are willing to offer an explanation it doesn't always answer the questions appropriately it may well be that it is nothing to be really concerned with but ..i see it on a daily basis morning and night every dayi am custodial as is her mother we just ain't married (not religious or see the need) we just never bothered with all that ..and she has never been in anyone else's custody apart from staying with her sister on a sleep-over. so as i see it keeping a record will at least show up any frequency rates on paper as the spoken word is often interjected i will keep searching for answers and my friend i hope i am wrong and that it ends up being nothing to worry about but in the mean time ill worry ....thanks again for the reply may i ask why you visit this forum do you or your familiy have reason to worry or are you here on a professional basis ?regards enrique
    enriqueveogente 6 Replies Flag this Response
  • JonMacthanks again for replying it really helps to talk..and after i posted i spoke to my boss whom has a five year old to that he says show signs of excitement by rubbing his face and showing a "mad expression" his words..and while i find it reassuring that people are willing to offer an explanation it doesn't always answer the questions appropriately it may well be that it is nothing to be really concerned with but ..i see it on a daily basis morning and night every dayi am custodial as is her mother we just ain't married (not religious or see the need) we just never bothered with all that ..and she has never been in anyone else's custody apart from staying with her sister on a sleep-over. so as i see it keeping a record will at least show up any frequency rates on paper as the spoken word is often interjected i will keep searching for answers and my friend i hope i am wrong and that it ends up being nothing to worry about but in the mean time ill worry ....thanks again for the reply may i ask why you visit this forum do you or your familiy have reason to worry or are you here on a professional basis ?regards enriqueHi enrique,I think learning that from your boss is very helpful re: telling you that you aren't alone. Kids can be very concerning when it comes to behavioral things.I think keeping a record is an excellent idea. Not only the frequency of episodes but the particular circumstances at the time of an episode will show if there is a particular pattern to your daughter's behavior. Another thing I would recommend is to present a "casual", not overly concerned attitude when episodes occur. If her behaviors are indeed attention-seeking you should see some increase at first but if you can maintain a minimum of attention-giving response you should see a gradual decrease in time.In answer to your question "may i ask why you visit this forum do you or your familiy have reason to worry or are you here on a professional basis ?"....I'm a health care professional with twenty three years of hands-on experience caring for a variety of patients, the majority of whom are kids/adolescents with developmental/neurological/behavioral disorders. Participating in this forum and contributing where I feel qualified to do so is very rewarding to me as there are so many people struggling to find answers/information regarding health issues. In addition, I have an excellent opportunity to expand my own knowledge here as there are many experienced practitioners posting.I have confidence that your daughter isn't exhibiting signs of any serious medical condition and I sincerely hope that you ultimately find her behaviors resolved.Best regards,John<
    JonMac 165 Replies Flag this Response
  • One of the best ways you might approach this issue is to see if you can capture her behavior on video & show it to your pediatrician. Sometimes a picture is worth a thousand words.
    aquila 1263 Replies Flag this Response
  • thanks john/aquilai know my boss means well trying to relieve my worry and his wife had epilepsy so he knows how serious a comment can be..and i really appreciate his compassion and i'm sure his boys display of excitement may be nothing to worry about either, but this is my daughters well-being i am watching as she has a spasm i am thinking of a thousand things to turn her attention, i ask her questions about school or what i see in the street just to see if she'll respond and perhaps to snap her out of it but it has hold of her like she cant control it, yet she knows its going to happen all the same.sometimes i'm in bits because i don't understand it and neither does she.she certainly isn't seeking attention and beside all this she is quite confident in herself and her abilities and i'm sure its not just something kids do, i have enough experience of kids to know that its not normal behaviour its kind of wierd because i know its a psychological/chemical ..thing ..is that what they mean by physiological ? because she is aware it is not normal and is embarrassed, i know this much because she plays it down herself and its far to complex in both the frequency and the reaction to what ever it is that is causing it ..she will say "i'm alright" as she is conscious of my worry ..and there are various degrees of strength or magnitude when she is less or more anxious or excited ...somtimes there is just a slight apprehension as if she has overcome it by distraction as if it was just about to start and dosen't that's what makes me think its psychological as if either a mental diversion has occurred or a physical/chemical blockand i have watched her when she is unaware of my presence when she is on her own it is less frequent only occasionally it happens when she is watching the tv on her own and i have seen here do it in the garden ..but it always seems to be in anticipation or something as if she has a pre emt and knows a few milliseconds before it is going to occur judging by the expression on her face i am going to film it but the camera i have is naff as is my phone cam but it may be enough to record it ..i just am weary about stuffing a camera in her face as she's about to do something uncontrollable, i don't want to make her any more anxious about it than she already is.. but i suppose i will just have to and my partner isn't happy about sticking her on you tube either which i can understand but i need an answer asap it is very distressing for me to watch my baby spasm thanks again for replying
    enriqueveogente 6 Replies Flag this Response
  • I REALLY don't want to down play your fears or worry's and I would be the same as you, wondering what in the world is happening and is there something I should be doing about it. In fact I am going through something with my 5 yr. old son that no one seems to have a clue about and I don't know if I am overreacting or should go more extreme in finding the answer. Anyway, about your daughter.......I hate to say this and was actually following your post hoping someone else would suggest this rather than me but here goes! On a rerun episode of "Dr. House" I saw a few weeks ago there was a woman that took her daughter in thinking she was having "seizures" every time she would put her in her car seat. It tuned out the little girl was having orgasms. I know it sounds impossible for a child but it would explain why it happens when she is excited or in her seat belt and why she is semi-concious of what is happening AND why she is starting to get embarassed about it. She is probably reaching the age where she is realizing it isn't quite "normal" to experiance or she is shy to talk about it. Once again, I am sorry to bring it up. I just know if I were you I would be anxious for ANYONES input, even if it's wrong. It's something to consider. Good luck to you!!! --Davanda
    Davanda 2 Replies Flag this Response
  • oh anybody's godWhat....double WHAT and what again....oh my oh my...please dont do this to me im only human..first telephone masts now this...jeeeeeez ok so i suppose when i pick myself up from the floor ..its something to consider so thanks for your input.. but please shes only five she watches "ruby the ballet star" and skips round the living room one one leg....i just cannot for the life of me believe what you have suggested.... i nearly ran a dog over on the way home from work ...on purpose ....what have you done to me ..well i suppose you've just brought me to realise that my daughter is in fact a female and i have to be aware of feminine issuses but hey im not ready for this ..i need a drink anybody care to join me????oh well i suppose you mean well in fact im sure you do and if you've never seen or been with her i suppose any angle would be a good starting point but if that we true id have to leave home and eek a living diving for clams on some remote island ....i wonder what bransons doing at the moment i wonder if he needs anyone to guard his palm trees....you might as well apologize ..no wonder you were hoping someone else might suggest it but thanks dear you've really made my day..i wont suggest what you son may be having diffculties with just keep an eye on him in the newsagents eh !!i suppose you have to laugh............
    enriqueveogente 6 Replies Flag this Response
  • hello guys well i have finally convinced her doctor and teachers after showing them footage of her behavior ...i had recorded her a few times and every time she wasn't aware of the camera so we have ruled out attention seeking and dare i say it ... no i dare not but you know what was in the previous posts ..i'm just going to pretend i didnt read that... :) anyhow she goes for an EG or whatever its called to diagnose her cerebral activity ..at least its a starting point ..she still remains the same in her patterns and is anxious when nobody else seems to be looking ....:rolleyes:ill keep you posted after the tests at the end of this month....thanks for being thereregards Enrique
    enriqueveogente 6 Replies
    • November 24, 2009
    • 11:28 PM
    • 0
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  • My daughter too has spasms. She has had them since i can remember she is eight now. It happens frequently when she is excited. Her mouth gapes open and her face shakes. She grips her arms together as if she is trying to control it. Sometimes she shakes her arms and hands as well, if we are walking or something. She can not control it, and can not repeat the action voluntarily, she is now eight. I have never brought it up to a pediatrician as it has not been a concern until recently when I was told it was abnormal for a child to be doing this. Have you learned anything since your research on it?
    Anonymous 42789 Replies Flag this Response
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  • My daughter too has spasms. She has had them since i can remember she is eight now. It happens frequently when she is excited. Her mouth gapes open and her face shakes. She grips her arms together as if she is trying to control it. Sometimes she shakes her arms and hands as well, if we are walking or something. She can not control it, and can not repeat the action voluntarily, she is now eight. I have never brought it up to a pediatrician as it has not been a concern until recently when I was told it was abnormal for a child to be doing this. Have you learned anything since your research on it?hello im sorry to say that i have come up against a brick wall so far my partner refuses to acknowledge anything out of the ordinary saying that i should take the advice of the pediatrician, whom told me that she has no worries or concerns about this type of behavior ....as if she knew what she was talking about.. i have my reservations about that ...i am hoping to find somebody within the medical profession with experience of this type of anxiety/excitement ..there are too many fearful conclusions to jump to i understand but there are times when the frequency is too great to ignoreif i ever find anything or more to the point anybody willing to explain ill will certainly let you know ..has your daughter had all the usuall inocculations ?is there any thing in particular that triggers it ? how often in a typical event does she react ? please email me with details if there are similaritieswe may need each others information.four-d-artist@hotmail.co.ukregards Enrique.
    enriqueveogente 6 Replies Flag this Response
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