Discussions By Condition: I cannot get a diagnosis.

B12 deficiency?

Posted In: I cannot get a diagnosis. 14 Replies
  • Posted By: Anonymous
  • November 9, 2008
  • 07:47 PM

Hi,
Looking for some help here. I was diagnosed with a vitamin B12 deficiency many years ago I think this was based on the size of my red blood cells. I recieved B12 injections for a couple of years. I've since been told by another Doctor that I don't have a B12 deficiency?
Can anyone tell me what test should be preformed to either diagnose or definitely rule out a B12 deficiency?
thanks,
Slick:confused:

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14 Replies:

  • B12 Deficiencies are levels Treatment should never consist of folate as a means to raise B12 in the presence of a deficiency, the result of which is irreversible neural damage. Secondly, an underlying cause should be sought unless your diet is severely restricted or you've underwent gastric bypass surgery, or have a GI inflammatory disease such as Crohn's disease or illeitis. Other than causes such as those mentioned, efforts to determine the cause should be investigated before simply electing to treat the deficiency. Best regards and Good Health
    JCottleMD 580 Replies
    • November 9, 2008
    • 09:47 PM
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  • Schilling test
    Anonymous 42789 Replies
    • November 10, 2008
    • 04:38 PM
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  • This is a symptom, not a disease. You may have celiac disease or an autoimmune deficiency, such as IgA deficiency, which is causing the B12 to rise and fall. Try here: http://www.wrongdiagnosis.com/v/vitamin_b12_deficiency/causes.htm
    aquila 1263 Replies
    • November 12, 2008
    • 09:01 PM
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  • I don't see any reference by anyone that this is being misconstrued as a disease. Furthermore, this person makes no mention of symptoms that are highly consistent with patients suffering from immunoglobulin A deficiency, ie chronic respiratory, oral and urinary tract infections that typically relapse following the standard course of antibiotic therapy. It is not a symptom in singular form that can establish a differential diagnostic consideration, but rather the company it keeps or more formally the constellation of symptoms and signs present in the patient. There is absolutely nothing of this person's description that would suggest IgA deficiency to even be remotely considered a differential. Best regards, J Cottle, MD
    JCottleMD 580 Replies
    • November 13, 2008
    • 00:50 AM
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  • Hi again,Just thought I'd give some background info. The reason I was initially given the B12 injections was due to Enlarged Red Blood Cells (and abnormally shaped) At this time I did have a really sore mouth. Absolutely no energy couldn't even stand up straight. I felt much better about 10 mins after I was given the injection, could stand straight and think again. Apologies for the following list of ailments. I've read this post back and looking at it I may just be a hypochondriac:rolleyes:. Maybe they're related to B12 defic. Any advice or suggestions on what else (if not B12) it could be would be very much appreciated...... I haven't recieved B12 injections for a few years now. My mouth is always sore, lumps on my tongue and it also has a dirty coating.. This causes a dull really irritating pain in my ear, clicking noises/under water, I have to pop them several times a day (but the affected left ear doesn't pop fully). I think this is due to sinus infection can't get a reason/diagnosis from Doctors. I'm fatigued all the time. I've also alot of joint pain in my hands, knees feet and ankles. Recently a couple of the bones in my foot have started cracking and sometimes dislocating (I think/assume) this causes unbearable pain in my foot which spreads to my ankle. It feels and looks like the blood circulation is blocked. I've also have alot of stomach problems bloating and pain I was diagnosed with IBS for this (which as far as I can see is what they say when they've no idea whats wrong). Thanks,Slick:)
    Anonymous 42789 Replies
    • November 13, 2008
    • 07:34 PM
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  • Okay, the symptoms you are describing are more associated with allergies and again, would not suggest the presence of a disorder like IgA deficiency. The symptoms of such disorders are rather dramatic in nature and not to be confused with common upper respiratory infections, etc. The difference is night and day. The bumps on your tongue are actually tonsillar tissue. Realize that tonsillar tissue is located throughout the oral cavity to the exclusion of the gums and can become inflamed for a variety of reasons. It is not uncommon for persons with allergies to experience clicking and popping sounds in the ears, due to mild inflammation of the eustachian tubes that commonly become clogged from sinus infection or simple allergenic response. A coated tongue does not necessarily constitute any type of disorder or signs of disease. Many persons with sinus problems tend to mouth breathe, particularly at night while asleep. The air being drawn across the tongue tends to dry out the surface along with the mucosal linings of the oral cavity in general. Geographic tongue, or whitish patches are a common appearance as well. Also realize that allergies and sinus problems can induce a good deal of fatigue and if you aren't sleeping well, this could tend to worsen the symptoms. Joints that pop or make noise do not dislocate. What you are hearing is the sound of free CO2 or carbon dioxide being compressed by the joint and causing the characteristic popping sound that most people can produce when stretching the finger joints. You problem more likely has to do with possible intermittent pain and discomfort from gout. IBS is indeed a diagnosis of exclusion but should not be taken to mean that it is a position of indifference on the part of your primary care physician. The fact that serious disease is not present, should begin to suggest to you that factors relevant to IBS and anxiety might be playing a greater role in your general complaints, albeit to the exclusion of any dyscrasic problems with your red blood cells. Best regards, J Cottle, MD
    JCottleMD 580 Replies
    • November 14, 2008
    • 01:07 AM
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  • Perhaps an autoimune disease-Lupus,but you also can`t ignore Megaloblastic anemia,find out what`s causing it;lack of intrinsec factor,achlorhidria.Some conditions are also linked with B12 deficiency like diverticulosis or intestinal anastomosis.You said that you`re not sure anymore if you got Megaloblastic anemia or not ,i simply can`t believe a doctor could be that stupid to misinterpretate the data refering to your eritrocytes
    Anonymous 42789 Replies
    • November 14, 2008
    • 06:22 PM
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  • I read your post once again,and i started thinking that indeed you may suffer from Megaloblastic Anemia because the lack of B12 affects(beside eritrocytes) especially the cells with a rapid growth rate,here are included the internal layer of the digestive tube ,tongue etc .Still the Anemia does not affect the joints(as far as i know) and that`s why i would also consider a second condition like Lupus
    Anonymous 42789 Replies
    • November 14, 2008
    • 06:57 PM
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  • I read your post once again,and i started thinking that indeed you may suffer from Megaloblastic Anemia because the lack of B12 affects(beside eritrocytes) especially the cells with a rapid growth rate,here are included the internal layer of the digestive tube ,tongue etc .Still the Anemia does not affect the joints(as far as i know) and that`s why i would also consider a second condition like Lupus
    Anonymous 42789 Replies
    • November 14, 2008
    • 07:14 PM
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  • Your additional information only makes me more strongly suspect that what you may have might be celiac disease. Here are some causes of B12 deficiency: http://www.wrongdiagnosis.com/v/vitamin_b12_deficiency/causes.htm http://www.wrongdiagnosis.com/s/selective_iga_deficiency/intro.htm http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/bsc/ajg/2001/00000096/00000003/art02409 I mention these things because your doctors seem to have stopped short at treating the symptom without identifying the underlying cause. Either that, or they obviously failed to effectively communicate with you about what is going on. This is what I was referring to when I mentioned that B12 deficiency is a symptom, not a cause of disease. I respectfully disagree, Dr. Cottle. I look for the constellation of symptoms for celiac and primary immunodeficiency on this site because these are relatively common conditions that doctors *frequently* miss. Often, the people who post here have been through the usua battery of tests looking for horses. Often, posters on this site are zebras and we should treat them as such.
    aquila 1263 Replies
    • November 14, 2008
    • 08:46 PM
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  • HI AquilaI totally agree withyou this happened to me and the damage went on and on needless to say I ended up very ill until the tests proved it in thier eyes what I had suspected all along B12 deficiency along with folate and vit D classical deficeincy for celiac disease and just because my celiac panel was negative the let it go until my GI said givethe diet ago as your damage may not be severe enogh to cause positive tests......needless to say he was right and I havent looked back since my doctor is very good at teating B12 with methylcobalamin the only one I would use 10,000 mcg 3 x a week after 4 months all symptoms gone so we will go to 2 a week now, being gluten free has helped hugely and I foolishly and I would NOT recommend this decide tp try the gluten will on B12 and I got a foggy head my jionts ached and some numbness returned so it appears to me that gluten can cause these symptoms on its own.......Not to mention those bowel problemsLOL:)I believe if I hadnt found the doctor who checked my B12 levels which were now 130 I would be in a nursing home....For more on my story go to 1b2 deficiency misdiagnosed on this site and tell us your medical story there are some very knowledgable people there who were misdaignsed or ignored,,,,,,,,,J cottle i would invite you to visit too you may find some very valuable info re b12 and as a MD that would be very benaficial for your patients.........
    Rainbows End 227 Replies
    • November 30, 2008
    • 11:17 PM
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  • JCottle, not every symptom comes out in the first post (or first doctor's visit even). So excuse me for saying this, but you are well on your way to becoming the typical doctor. But as you can see, this forum is full of people who are still sick, in spite of the superior education of their doctors. I really think you should read the following book, JCottle - 'Currents of Death' by Paul Brodeur. After you've read it, I'd like to discuss it with you in hopes that one doctor in America finally realizes that all diseases are caused by the same thing, and that modern medicine is a joke in that it separates every bodily system from the other, as if they are unrelated. I'm entirely disinterested in any discourse regarding the dillusional beliefs that cell phone waves and electrical currents are invading the bodies of all human beings and is responsible for all illness and disease. I've stated it before and I'll reiterate it here; your condition is extremely pathological in nature and I'll once again suggest to you that you seek professional intervention to discover why you believe things are invading your body and making you ill. Mr. Paul Brodeur is certifiable and his claims are not substantiated in the very least by medical fact or research. It is a fabrication based upon delusional thinking and constitutes a psychiatric disorder. People who come to this forum do not have what you're characterizing as disease from cell phone use or exposure to electrical current. Nor do they have Lyme disease. Your impressions regarding these matters are extremely distorted and I implore you to seek psychiatric intervention. Lastly, I'm not on my way to becoming anything typical. I'm a retired neurologist and served more than 40 years in successful practice. I wish you the best, but again suggest that you seek professional help. Best regards, J Cottle, MD
    JCottleMD 580 Replies
    • December 1, 2008
    • 02:58 AM
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  • Often, the people who post here have been through the usua battery of tests looking for horses. Often, posters on this site are zebras and we should treat them as such. Zebras and horses alike would still fall under the actual examination and evaluation by licensed veterinarians. Respondants to this forum are absolutely unabashed in offering medical advice as though exposure to a condition or similarity in frustration with the medical community somehow confers expertise. I'm constrained to point out that the very persons who complain that the medical community doesn't know the answers are the same persons advising folks to obtain certain tests or treatment through the very same medical venue. By example, who do you think originally discovered celiac disease or has found cures for certain cancers and improving treatments for diabetes or technological advancements in treating heart disease and stroke? The list is unending and I must point out that none of the accomplishments were mastered by a group of disgruntled and frustrated patients who simply struck out on their own to teach the allopathic medical community a thing or two. The comments being randomly and recklessly thrown toward people asking medical questions has absolutely no basis in medical fact and in the absence of direct evaluation and medical training or experience, is certainly no closer to the truth than the predicament already being suffered. After spending some limited time on the forum, what I see more than anything is a group of people erroneously believe themselves to be competent in dictating medical advice and treatment in the entire absence of the requisites to do so accurately and with prudence. It is, in essence, a characterization and belief that the organ grinder should switch places with the monkey in order to succeed. Best regards, J Cottle, MD
    JCottleMD 580 Replies
    • December 1, 2008
    • 03:22 AM
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  • Zebras and horses alike would still fall under the actual examination and evaluation by licensed veterinarians. Respondants to this forum are absolutely unabashed in offering medical advice as though exposure to a condition or similarity in frustration with the medical community somehow confers expertise. I'm constrained to point out that the very persons who complain that the medical community doesn't know the answers are the same persons advising folks to obtain certain tests or treatment through the very same medical venue. By example, who do you think originally discovered celiac disease or has found cures for certain cancers and improving treatments for diabetes or technological advancements in treating heart disease and stroke? The list is unending and I must point out that none of the accomplishments were mastered by a group of disgruntled and frustrated patients who simply struck out on their own to teach the allopathic medical community a thing or two. The comments being randomly and recklessly thrown toward people asking medical questions has absolutely no basis in medical fact and in the absence of direct evaluation and medical training or experience, is certainly no closer to the truth than the predicament already being suffered. After spending some limited time on the forum, what I see more than anything is a group of people erroneously believe themselves to be competent in dictating medical advice and treatment in the entire absence of the requisites to do so accurately and with prudence. It is, in essence, a characterization and belief that the organ grinder should switch places with the monkey in order to succeed. Best regards, J Cottle, MDDear J Cottle MDIt would be prudent you would not be a MD if it were not for your patients.....ANd this is what this forum is about after all people coming together to share their situations and feelings and stories of diagnoses and misdiagnoses offering the experiences they have had to give some inspiration.......It took over 5 years for me to get a diagnoses I am now being treated with a therapy I discovered on these boards so I think it can be useful.....Not all of us think doctors are a waste of time at all it comes from being purely frustrated when the doctor turns his nose at you and doesnt want to listen it is all too hard you have to see so many people in one day you simpley may not have the time tihe doc is not always to blame for this.....But when they view themselves hollier than thou that is their problem.....I am not saying this directly to you so please dont take it that way I am being general you will find people have their gripes being very ill is a hard place to be and for some it is scarey and confusing no one here is diagnosing any one by any means just offering some help if they can......For instance I was conversing to one who didnt know what else to do was very sick had had plenty of tests she was like me symptoms were like me...I told her she could suggest B12 to her d octor and what do you know this had never been done for her and she ended up with a B12 deficiency a simple test and easy to treat.....This has happened a lot of times ....the suggestions may be useless but they may not be either..............A few of my family members have what I have but their doctors like some of mine refused to test or believe them and guess what when tested they have it ........The patient is the one who has the problems you cant diagnose us just by looking at us you have to ask questions and sometimes we need to answer without a question but at times it falls upon deaf ears.........I dont understand if you find this forum offensive why are you responding on it in the first place..........regardsrainbows End
    Rainbows End 227 Replies
    • December 1, 2008
    • 04:05 AM
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